KAN — Israel Public Broadcasting Corporation / קן — תאגיד השידור הישראלי News Division — Prime Time Broadcast Transcript of recorded interview, aired 14 September 2015, 21:07 IST Interviewer: Gal Peretz, Senior Defence Correspondent Subject: Minister of Defence Avigdor Baram
[Translator’s note: Translated from Hebrew. Interview conducted in Hebrew. Minister Baram occasionally shifted to English for specific technical terms; these are rendered as spoken.] Archive reference: KAN-2015-0914-ND
PERETZ: Minister, the reports coming out of Geneva and from our own intelligence assessments — what can you tell the Israeli public tonight about what the Soviets have actually transferred to Iran?
BARAM: I can tell you what has been confirmed and what I’m able to say publicly. What has been confirmed is that there is a civil nuclear cooperation agreement between Moscow and Tehran. What is being described — by multiple sources — is that this agreement includes technology transfer related to the thorium fuel cycle. The same technology the Soviets have been operating domestically for nearly twenty years.
PERETZ: The same technology as the Cuba plant.
BARAM: Structurally similar, yes. A Soviet-design thorium reactor. The Iranians will not be building it themselves from scratch — there will be Soviet engineers, Soviet components, a Soviet operational framework. The same model as Cienfuegos.
PERETZ: And in exchange — what are the Soviets receiving?
BARAM: (pause) I’m going to be careful here. There are ongoing intelligence matters I’m not going to discuss on television. What I will say is that the Soviets are fighting a war. They have needs. Iran has capabilities. Transactions happen.
PERETZ: Minister, with respect — our viewers understand what that means. The question the public is asking is: does this deal end the Iranian nuclear threat? Is Iran, after this, still a nuclear threat to Israel?
BARAM: The Iranian uranium enrichment programme, as of the agreements concluded in the last several weeks, is being suspended. Permanently, according to Tehran. The IAEA will be verifying that suspension. The facilities at Natanz and Fordow — we are being told they will be converted or decommissioned.
PERETZ: And you believe that?
BARAM: I believe the Iranians have made a rational calculation. They are receiving something they have wanted for thirty years — genuine energy independence, a civilian nuclear programme that no one can credibly call a weapons programme, and Soviet protection of that programme. In exchange, they are giving up something that was never going to give them a weapon without triggering a war that would have destroyed them. (beat) Yes. I believe they made the calculation.
PERETZ: So the military option — the option this government has maintained for fifteen years, the option my colleagues in this studio have reported on, the option that previous prime ministers have threatened and prepared for — that option is now —
BARAM: (quietly) The technical and legal basis for that option has become significantly more complicated.
PERETZ: Significantly more complicated. That’s the phrase you’re using.
BARAM: That’s the phrase I’m using.
PERETZ: Minister — is Israel safe tonight?
BARAM: (long pause) Israel is always in a complicated neighbourhood. What I can tell you is that the specific scenario we spent fifteen years preparing for has changed in ways we did not anticipate and did not prefer. We are assessing. We are adapting. That is what we do.
PERETZ: Thank you, Minister.
BARAM: (nods)
[END OF INTERVIEW TRANSCRIPT] Transcript archived by KAN News Division. Broadcast excerpt shared by permission. Full broadcast available in KAN archive reference KAN-2015-0914-ND.
Related sources: Reuters: Cuba’s Soviet-Built Thorium Plant Nears Full Output (2013) | Dror Eilon, The Reactor and the Missile, Ch. 4 (2017) | Iran | Soviet Union